Dynomotion

Group: DynoMotion Message: 13193 From: embraced338 Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: KFlop+Kanalog advice with Yaskawa servos
Hi all,

I've got a 3 axis system + closed loop spindle that I'm building right now.

I'm using the KFlop with a Kanalog and Konnect.

I've got the Kanalog purely for driving the spindle motor (+-10v) and receiving it's quadrature encoder input to perform rigid tapping.

The 3 axis drives are Yaskawa Sigma-7's, controlled by step and direction on JP5.
The spindle drive is a Delta VFD-VE drive, controlled by Kanalog's DAC0 output.

I'd like to use the Yaskawa's Z phase outputs to perform index homing, but to my knowledge the only output on the Z phase is quadrature, and with the spindle's A+B+Z phase occupying JP1 channel 0 and 1, I do not have enough channels left on JP1 to put all 3 axis drive Z phase outputs there.

So far my thought has been to use an MC3486 differential line receiver to convert the quadrature outputs into single ended for the KFlop to handle on some input (not sure about this - I'm not an expert with electronics).


Does this sound reasonable? 
Is it impossible to have two Z phase outputs in one Kanalog encoder channel?

Perhaps someone has experience with these drives and can tell me whether they support an open-collector output for the Z phase (many drives do).

Finally, I've attached a screenshot of the manual describing the outputs, if it's of any use.


Thanks,


Lindsay
  @@attachment@@
Group: DynoMotion Message: 13194 From: Moray Cuthill Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: KFlop+Kanalog advice with Yaskawa servos [1 Attachment]
Hi Lindsay,

Just to clear things up to begin with, quadrature refers to the relationship between the A and B encoder signals. The best way to think of the Z output, is an output that pulses once every revolution. Although it's pulse will have a specific timed relation to the A&B quadrature, it is irrelevant for most applications.
Quadrature signals can be single ended aka single wire, or differential aka twin wire. The key difference with differential is, as one wire goes high, the other goes low.

You can often use a single wire from a differential signal/pair to power a single ended receiver, however it can be more susceptible to noise. If noise is a concern, then you can use a differential receiver like the MC3486 to minimise any noise problems.

Now we've covered that, the Z output can be connected to any suitable input. In terms of using it to home, all you need is for it to switch an input, as all the homing routine does is rotate the servo slowly until the input switches.

If you wanted to share a differential input, you could do something like add a DPDT relay to switch between differential pairs. Given the voltages/currents involved, you could probably get away with some of the DIP size relays, or small reed relays.

Moray 


On Sat, Apr 23, 2016 at 9:30 AM, embraced338@... [DynoMotion] <DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 
[Attachment(s) from embraced338@... [DynoMotion] included below]

Hi all,


I've got a 3 axis system + closed loop spindle that I'm building right now.

I'm using the KFlop with a Kanalog and Konnect.

I've got the Kanalog purely for driving the spindle motor (+-10v) and receiving it's quadrature encoder input to perform rigid tapping.

The 3 axis drives are Yaskawa Sigma-7's, controlled by step and direction on JP5.
The spindle drive is a Delta VFD-VE drive, controlled by Kanalog's DAC0 output.

I'd like to use the Yaskawa's Z phase outputs to perform index homing, but to my knowledge the only output on the Z phase is quadrature, and with the spindle's A+B+Z phase occupying JP1 channel 0 and 1, I do not have enough channels left on JP1 to put all 3 axis drive Z phase outputs there.

So far my thought has been to use an MC3486 differential line receiver to convert the quadrature outputs into single ended for the KFlop to handle on some input (not sure about this - I'm not an expert with electronics).


Does this sound reasonable? 
Is it impossible to have two Z phase outputs in one Kanalog encoder channel?

Perhaps someone has experience with these drives and can tell me whether they support an open-collector output for the Z phase (many drives do).

Finally, I've attached a screenshot of the manual describing the outputs, if it's of any use.


Thanks,


Lindsay


Group: DynoMotion Message: 13195 From: Tom Kerekes Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: KFlop+Kanalog advice with Yaskawa servos
Hi Lindsay,

You should be able to make use of the 8 differential inputs circuits on Kanalog JP2 for Z index pulses by wiring the signals coming out of Kanalog JP9 back into the GPIO inputs on Kanalog JP12.  Don't worry about connecting the 5V TTL outputs to the 3.3V inputs as those outputs do not drive high enough or with enough current to be a problem.

You only need 4 so wire:

JP9 Pin1 to JP12 Pin1
JP9 Pin2 to JP12 Pin2
JP9 Pin3 to JP12 Pin3
JP9 Pin4 to JP12 Pin4

The Z Index inputs should then show up as I/O 128, 129, 130, 131.

HTH
Regards
TK

On 4/23/2016 11:06 AM, Moray Cuthill moray.cuthill@... [DynoMotion] wrote:
 
Hi Lindsay,

Just to clear things up to begin with, quadrature refers to the relationship between the A and B encoder signals. The best way to think of the Z output, is an output that pulses once every revolution. Although it's pulse will have a specific timed relation to the A&B quadrature, it is irrelevant for most applications.
Quadrature signals can be single ended aka single wire, or differential aka twin wire. The key difference with differential is, as one wire goes high, the other goes low.

You can often use a single wire from a differential signal/pair to power a single ended receiver, however it can be more susceptible to noise. If noise is a concern, then you can use a differential receiver like the MC3486 to minimise any noise problems.

Now we've covered that, the Z output can be connected to any suitable input. In terms of using it to home, all you need is for it to switch an input, as all the homing routine does is rotate the servo slowly until the input switches.

If you wanted to share a differential input, you could do something like add a DPDT relay to switch between differential pairs. Given the voltages/currents involved, you could probably get away with some of the DIP size relays, or small reed relays.

Moray 


On Sat, Apr 23, 2016 at 9:30 AM, embraced338@... [DynoMotion] <DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 
[Attachment(s) from embraced338@... [DynoMotion] included below]

Hi all,


I've got a 3 axis system + closed loop spindle that I'm building right now.

I'm using the KFlop with a Kanalog and Konnect.

I've got the Kanalog purely for driving the spindle motor (+-10v) and receiving it's quadrature encoder input to perform rigid tapping.

The 3 axis drives are Yaskawa Sigma-7's, controlled by step and direction on JP5.
The spindle drive is a Delta VFD-VE drive, controlled by Kanalog's DAC0 output.

I'd like to use the Yaskawa's Z phase outputs to perform index homing, but to my knowledge the only output on the Z phase is quadrature, and with the spindle's A+B+Z phase occupying JP1 channel 0 and 1, I do not have enough channels left on JP1 to put all 3 axis drive Z phase outputs there.

So far my thought has been to use an MC3486 differential line receiver to convert the quadrature outputs into single ended for the KFlop to handle on some input (not sure about this - I'm not an expert with electronics).


Does this sound reasonable? 
Is it impossible to have two Z phase outputs in one Kanalog encoder channel?

Perhaps someone has experience with these drives and can tell me whether they support an open-collector output for the Z phase (many drives do).

Finally, I've attached a screenshot of the manual describing the outputs, if it's of any use.


Thanks,


Lindsay


Group: DynoMotion Message: 13209 From: jerrybiehler Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Re: KFlop+Kanalog advice with Yaskawa servos
You have nice Sigma 7 drives which have really good on the fly auto tuning. I would just use step/direction inputs and not analog. If you really wanted to you could bring back the encoder signals to the kflop but it is pretty unnecessary. I used the Sigma V drives on a recent project and they are great. The auto tune works very well.
Group: DynoMotion Message: 13210 From: embraced338 Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Re: KFlop+Kanalog advice with Yaskawa servos
Hi Jerry,

They certainly are nice drivers, particularly the vibration cancellation (phase cancellation) feature they've got, and 24 bit encoders.

I am using step and direction on them, with the open-collector feature on the KFlop and servo - though I'll soon be using some line drivers to convert the TTL from the KFlop to RS422 for the drivers to take advantage of the 2.5MHz output frequency attainable by the KFlop (the drivers can accept up to 4MHz!).