Dynomotion

Group: DynoMotion Message: 3893 From: himykabibble Date: 2/14/2012
Subject: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
I'm confused by what I see when I try to use fixture offsets. If I fire up KMotionCNC, then set the DROS to X=1.0, Y=2.0, Z=3.0, A=4.0, then MDI "G55", I expect to see the DROs go back to all zeroes. But, instead they don't change at all. Why does changing fixtures with G54-G59 appear to have no effect?

Regards,
Ray L.
Group: DynoMotion Message: 3894 From: Tom Kerekes Date: 2/14/2012
Subject: Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
Ray,
 
G54-59 select different offset settings.  Off all the fixture offsets are set to the same thing or zero then there won't be any change
 
TK

Group: DynoMotion Message: 3895 From: himykabibble Date: 2/14/2012
Subject: Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
Tom,

In Mach3, I would use G54-59 to select a fixture, then move the machine to the zero for that fixture, and zero the DROs. If I then change fixtures with G54-59, the DROs would change, to reflect the different offsets set for the different fixtures. I can't get that behavior at all with KMotionCNC. G54-G59 seem to have no effect whatsoever that I can see. The DROs NEVER change when I execute a G54-49, no matter what I've done to the DROs.

Regards,
Ray L.

--- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@...> wrote:
>
> Ray,
>  
> G54-59 select different offset settings.  Off all the fixture offsets are set to the same thing or zero then there won't be any change
>  
> TK
>
> From: himykabibble <jagboy@...>
> To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2012 3:52 PM
> Subject: [DynoMotion] Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
>
>
>  
> I'm confused by what I see when I try to use fixture offsets. If I fire up KMotionCNC, then set the DROS to X=1.0, Y=2.0, Z=3.0, A=4.0, then MDI "G55", I expect to see the DROs go back to all zeroes. But, instead they don't change at all. Why does changing fixtures with G54-G59 appear to have no effect?
>
> Regards,
> Ray L.
>
Group: DynoMotion Message: 3896 From: Tom Kerekes Date: 2/14/2012
Subject: Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
Hi Ray,
 
The only way to set the Fixture Offsets in KMotionCNC is with G10 (or maybe with the .var file).  ie.
 
G10L2P1X0Y0Z0 (Set G54 offset to 0,0,0 used by default)
G10L2P2X2Y0Z0 (Set G55 offset to 2,0,0)
G10L2P3X0Y2Z0 (Set G55 offset to 0,2,0)
 
I think in the .NET interface Brad put in ways to set them from your App. 
 
The "Zero" on the KMotionCNC affects the G90 global offset which is different than the "Zero" button in Mach3 which changes the "work" or fixture offset.
 
I don't know which is better.  We haven't had any complaints.  Isn't the idea of fixtures such that there is a fixed known distance between them so you don't need to zero each one separately?
 
Regards
TK
 
 
 
 

Group: DynoMotion Message: 3897 From: himykabibble Date: 2/14/2012
Subject: Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
Tom,

I've always found the most convenient way to set fixture offsets is to use the same methods used for setting G92 - position the machine using probing/edge finding/etc. to part zero (or some other reference position), then set the DROs. Or, if there is a known offset between fixtures, locate to one fixture zero, then change fixtures and enter the proper new values into the DROs. Your way works, just more typing.

"The "Zero" on the KMotionCNC affects the G90 global offset" - Do you mean G92? G90 sets absolute distance mode.

Regards,
Ray L.

--- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Ray,
>  
> The only way to set the Fixture Offsets in KMotionCNC is with G10 (or maybe with the .var file).  ie.
>  
> G10L2P1X0Y0Z0 (Set G54 offset to 0,0,0 used by default)
> G10L2P2X2Y0Z0 (Set G55 offset to 2,0,0)
> G10L2P3X0Y2Z0 (Set G55 offset to 0,2,0)
>  
> I think in the .NET interface Brad put in ways to set them from your App. 
>  
> The "Zero" on the KMotionCNC affects the G90 global offset which is different than the "Zero" button in Mach3 which changes the "work" or fixture offset.
>  
> I don't know which is better.  We haven't had any complaints.  Isn't the idea of fixtures such that there is a fixed known distance between them so you don't need to zero each one separately?
>  
> Regards
> TK
>  
>  
>  
>  
>
> From: himykabibble <jagboy@...>
> To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2012 4:03 PM
> Subject: [DynoMotion] Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
>
>
>  
> Tom,
>
> In Mach3, I would use G54-59 to select a fixture, then move the machine to the zero for that fixture, and zero the DROs. If I then change fixtures with G54-59, the DROs would change, to reflect the different offsets set for the different fixtures. I can't get that behavior at all with KMotionCNC. G54-G59 seem to have no effect whatsoever that I can see. The DROs NEVER change when I execute a G54-49, no matter what I've done to the DROs.
>
> Regards,
> Ray L.
>
> --- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@> wrote:
> >
> > Ray,
> >  
> > G54-59 select different offset settings.  Off all the fixture offsets are set to the same thing or zero then there won't be any change
> >  
> > TK
> >
> > From: himykabibble <jagboy@>
> > To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2012 3:52 PM
> > Subject: [DynoMotion] Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
> >
> >
> >  
> > I'm confused by what I see when I try to use fixture offsets. If I fire up KMotionCNC, then set the DROS to X=1.0, Y=2.0, Z=3.0, A=4.0, then MDI "G55", I expect to see the DROs go back to all zeroes. But, instead they don't change at all. Why does changing fixtures with G54-G59 appear to have no effect?
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ray L.
> >
>
Group: DynoMotion Message: 3898 From: himykabibble Date: 2/14/2012
Subject: Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
Tom,

I've modified my app to work the way Mach3 does, so I'm happy.

I'm curious though.... In Mach3, G92 and G52 were frought with peril, and an area of many bugs. As a result, they were rarely, and very carefully, used. Are there any such issues in the KMotion interpreter? I'm guessing not?

Regards,
Ray L.

--- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, "himykabibble" <jagboy@...> wrote:
>
> Tom,
>
> I've always found the most convenient way to set fixture offsets is to use the same methods used for setting G92 - position the machine using probing/edge finding/etc. to part zero (or some other reference position), then set the DROs. Or, if there is a known offset between fixtures, locate to one fixture zero, then change fixtures and enter the proper new values into the DROs. Your way works, just more typing.
>
> "The "Zero" on the KMotionCNC affects the G90 global offset" - Do you mean G92? G90 sets absolute distance mode.
>
> Regards,
> Ray L.
>
> --- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Ray,
> >  
> > The only way to set the Fixture Offsets in KMotionCNC is with G10 (or maybe with the .var file).  ie.
> >  
> > G10L2P1X0Y0Z0 (Set G54 offset to 0,0,0 used by default)
> > G10L2P2X2Y0Z0 (Set G55 offset to 2,0,0)
> > G10L2P3X0Y2Z0 (Set G55 offset to 0,2,0)
> >  
> > I think in the .NET interface Brad put in ways to set them from your App. 
> >  
> > The "Zero" on the KMotionCNC affects the G90 global offset which is different than the "Zero" button in Mach3 which changes the "work" or fixture offset.
> >  
> > I don't know which is better.  We haven't had any complaints.  Isn't the idea of fixtures such that there is a fixed known distance between them so you don't need to zero each one separately?
> >  
> > Regards
> > TK
> >  
> >  
> >  
> >  
> >
> > From: himykabibble <jagboy@>
> > To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2012 4:03 PM
> > Subject: [DynoMotion] Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
> >
> >
> >  
> > Tom,
> >
> > In Mach3, I would use G54-59 to select a fixture, then move the machine to the zero for that fixture, and zero the DROs. If I then change fixtures with G54-59, the DROs would change, to reflect the different offsets set for the different fixtures. I can't get that behavior at all with KMotionCNC. G54-G59 seem to have no effect whatsoever that I can see. The DROs NEVER change when I execute a G54-49, no matter what I've done to the DROs.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ray L.
> >
> > --- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Ray,
> > >  
> > > G54-59 select different offset settings.  Off all the fixture offsets are set to the same thing or zero then there won't be any change
> > >  
> > > TK
> > >
> > > From: himykabibble <jagboy@>
> > > To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2012 3:52 PM
> > > Subject: [DynoMotion] Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
> > >
> > >
> > >  
> > > I'm confused by what I see when I try to use fixture offsets. If I fire up KMotionCNC, then set the DROS to X=1.0, Y=2.0, Z=3.0, A=4.0, then MDI "G55", I expect to see the DROs go back to all zeroes. But, instead they don't change at all. Why does changing fixtures with G54-G59 appear to have no effect?
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Ray L.
> > >
> >
>
Group: DynoMotion Message: 3899 From: Tom Kerekes Date: 2/14/2012
Subject: Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
Yes I meant G92
 
TK

Group: DynoMotion Message: 3900 From: Tom Kerekes Date: 2/14/2012
Subject: Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
None that I'm aware of.
 
Regards
TK

Group: DynoMotion Message: 3901 From: himykabibble Date: 2/15/2012
Subject: Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
Tom,

I'm trying to make sure I understand how to properly calculate offsets, when G54-59, and G92/52 are involved. If G92/52 are not involved, it's quite simple. But when G92/52 are brought in, it seems to me rather confusing (a shame, since I think it could have been pretty simple had they been defined differently....). But it appears to me when setting G92/52 or G54-59 offsets I need to look at current machine position, and G92/52 offsets (in parameters 5211-5216), and the desired new, final work coordinate to calculate the offsets correctly. I believe the calculation (for X axis, G54) looks like this:

XCurrentWorkPos = XMachinePos - G92XOffset - G54XOffset ==>
XCurrentWorkPos = XMachinePos - [#5211] - G54XOffset

So, if we want to calculate the G54Offset to put us at XNewWorkPos:

G54XOffset = XMachinePos - [#5211] - XNewWorkPos

which we can set with:

G10 L2 P2 X[XMachinePos - [#5211] - XNewWorkPos]

Can I also do this programmatically using:

KM_Controller.Interpreter.SetupParams.X_AxisOffset?

To shift the G92 offset to put the work position at XNewWorkPos:

G92XOffset = XMachinePos - G54XOffset - XNewWorkPos

which we can set with either:

G92 XCurrentWorkPos or:
G52 [XMachinePos - G54XOffset - XNewWorkPos]

Can I also do this programmatically using:

KMController.Interpreter.SetupParams.X_OriginOffset? Will this update #5211?

Do I have this right?

Regards,
Ray L.






--- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@...> wrote:
>
> None that I'm aware of.
>  
> Regards
> TK
>
> From: himykabibble <jagboy@...>
> To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2012 6:09 PM
> Subject: [DynoMotion] Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
>
>
>  
> Tom,
>
> I've modified my app to work the way Mach3 does, so I'm happy.
>
> I'm curious though.... In Mach3, G92 and G52 were frought with peril, and an area of many bugs. As a result, they were rarely, and very carefully, used. Are there any such issues in the KMotion interpreter? I'm guessing not?
>
> Regards,
> Ray L.
>
> --- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, "himykabibble" <jagboy@> wrote:
> >
> > Tom,
> >
> > I've always found the most convenient way to set fixture offsets is to use the same methods used for setting G92 - position the machine using probing/edge finding/etc. to part zero (or some other reference position), then set the DROs. Or, if there is a known offset between fixtures, locate to one fixture zero, then change fixtures and enter the proper new values into the DROs. Your way works, just more typing.
> >
> > "The "Zero" on the KMotionCNC affects the G90 global offset" - Do you mean G92? G90 sets absolute distance mode.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ray L.
> >
> > --- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi Ray,
> > >  
> > > The only way to set the Fixture Offsets in KMotionCNC is with G10 (or maybe with the .var file).  ie.
> > >  
> > > G10L2P1X0Y0Z0 (Set G54 offset to 0,0,0 used by default)
> > > G10L2P2X2Y0Z0 (Set G55 offset to 2,0,0)
> > > G10L2P3X0Y2Z0 (Set G55 offset to 0,2,0)
> > >  
> > > I think in the .NET interface Brad put in ways to set them from your App. 
> > >  
> > > The "Zero" on the KMotionCNC affects the G90 global offset which is different than the "Zero" button in Mach3 which changes the "work" or fixture offset.
> > >  
> > > I don't know which is better.  We haven't had any complaints.  Isn't the idea of fixtures such that there is a fixed known distance between them so you don't need to zero each one separately?
> > >  
> > > Regards
> > > TK
> > >  
> > >  
> > >  
> > >  
> > >
> > > From: himykabibble <jagboy@>
> > > To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2012 4:03 PM
> > > Subject: [DynoMotion] Re: Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
> > >
> > >
> > >  
> > > Tom,
> > >
> > > In Mach3, I would use G54-59 to select a fixture, then move the machine to the zero for that fixture, and zero the DROs. If I then change fixtures with G54-59, the DROs would change, to reflect the different offsets set for the different fixtures. I can't get that behavior at all with KMotionCNC. G54-G59 seem to have no effect whatsoever that I can see. The DROs NEVER change when I execute a G54-49, no matter what I've done to the DROs.
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Ray L.
> > >
> > > --- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Ray,
> > > >  
> > > > G54-59 select different offset settings.  Off all the fixture offsets are set to the same thing or zero then there won't be any change
> > > >  
> > > > TK
> > > >
> > > > From: himykabibble <jagboy@>
> > > > To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2012 3:52 PM
> > > > Subject: [DynoMotion] Fixture Offsets - What Am I Missing?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >  
> > > > I'm confused by what I see when I try to use fixture offsets. If I fire up KMotionCNC, then set the DROS to X=1.0, Y=2.0, Z=3.0, A=4.0, then MDI "G55", I expect to see the DROs go back to all zeroes. But, instead they don't change at all. Why does changing fixtures with G54-G59 appear to have no effect?
> > > >
> > > > Regards,
> > > > Ray L.
> > > >
> > >
> >
>